thanks a lot for sharing Tangle Eye as well! Just finished it. Great read, great way to see that anticipation and uncertainty played out! Also, that first scene (and all subsequent flashbacks) was an emotional gut punch that made me want to keep reading. Cheers!
Hey Tony, I found a six part series in: GO INTO THE STORY, on writer: Mickey Fisher (creator of Extant and Reverie TV series.) I don't know if you know him/know of him-- but he sure seems like a likeable/cool dude.
Just thought I'd share it with you (and your readers), since he fits the bill of an "outsider" in the film industry, as you've also described yourself.
Interestingly, he touches on some of the same valuable insights (from the inside), that you have-- and many others.
He shares a lot of great lessons from personal experience; from the inception of his TV series concept/pilot, writing it, the pilot finally getting traction, getting repped-- all the way through to being green-lighted with a major TV studio. A valuable peek behind the curtain-- as it were. Enjoy.
Hi Tony, I hope you're well! As I've said many posts before, I sincerely, sincerely appreciate your efforts to share your knowledge! A million thanks. With that, I have a question I don't believe you've touched on but if you have, apologies - I'll get to it! I just haven't yet gotten through all your content (kid, work, writing, blah, blah).
Do you have any thoughts on the risk/benefit of producing content related to a script? I've got a production/acting background, a little Blackmagic camera and connections to a fair amount of good actors in Canada. Given how hard it is to sell specs, get noticed, etc., do you see there being any benefits to sending along, say, a self-produced trailer (taking for granted it's half decent) for a series? Would this in any way increase the odds of a show actually getting bought/produced/have others jump on board for a package? I know the odds are SO slim but just thought I'd get your take. I'm 35 (wasted 15 years drinking) and want to try and make the most forward movement possible.
For example, I'm working on a dramedy series about a mild-mannered pianist who, after losing his arms in a fire and originally forsaking music, tries to become a singer/disability advocate despite the fact he's not great at singing. I know it's so hard to sell scripts but I actually want to get this made. I'm working with an actor friend of mine who would play the lead character and I do believe - given some of your other thoughts - that it's got a lot of the "right stuff" in terms of making others look good. Who wouldn't want to jump on a show that deals with such subject matter in a funny with an unusual lead (... right)? He's been on an HBO show and is a legit good actor but not nearly at the level that he's broadly known. Am I delusional to think I could make this happen? Any thoughts broadly speaking on the matter? Given where you're at with your career (directing, writing, etc.), do you think you could have accelerated it if you'd produced some stuff along the way? Maybe written a micro-budget feature and shot it?
"In truth, I think not worrying about setting up a season of TV freed me to just make the pilot into a writing showcase."
THIS I needed to read. I've spent so much time banging my head over whether this or that pilot could sustain a season or a series, whether the protagonist has enough arc left or if I've cashed them in completely by the final act, whether there are enough peripheral loose ends, etc. etc. etc. I had it in my head that I'd need to talk about a script like I'm actually selling a show when, as you've made clear, that's not really what's being sold at the start.
It's interesting what you say about TANGLE EYE because I have no idea where that story was going to go--but to this day I really, really want to see it.
The other useful highlight here is your point about figuring out what, as an outsider, one has to offer. What particular perspective. I like how you put it--that vague admiration for craft from 100 readers doesn't measure up to a strong negative/positive reception. Freddie DeBoer made a similar point not too long ago:
"... consider the world in which I predicted the criticism and decided to make that piece less personal, less stylized, less intense…. In that world maybe the critics would go from disliking the piece intensely to liking it mildly. But those people who loved it would also now merely like it, and what would be gained?"
^This was a big insight for me, and your post has sort of solidified the insight in a more practical and specific way.
My mindset has has been: "I need to show competence and range." And that's what I've been working on: samples that will show that I understand storytelling form and that I can fit into all sorts of genres and jobs. There have been rewarding aspects to this, mainly in the way these goals work as exercises challenging me to try things that are outside my wheelhouse. BUT... to some degree, they also alienate me from my wheelhouse! As if a wheelhouse were some sort of dirty thing, when it really just means having an actual signature, an actual background, actual passions to communicate.
The fear of being pigeonholed resonates with the fear of being criticized: both fears ultimately separate us from our excitement, our desire. And then all that's left is the mild appreciation elicited by our competence and range. So... yeah. Like I said, I really needed to read this.
Thanks so much for this. It's been one of the most useful bits of screenwriting advice I've ever read, and has inspired me to reshuffle my creative priorities. I've started something new as a result, and am fired up. Enjoyed reading Tangle Eye too. Really want to know what happens to Hollis!
So glad you're enjoying the posts. In terms of the questions:
Resistance to poor/working class stories. I'd say it's more utter lack of interest than active resistance. You can feel the energy drop in any industry conversation when a story is set in a working class world, or if it has an active component about class. Everyone who has the power in the industry to say 'yes' to a project is of course quite rich, and probably comes from a privileged background. I just don't think they're interested in poorer worlds unless, say, a nice middle-class or better person gets yanked into a poorer world (OZARK/BREAKING BAD) or if it's a story about someone getting out. Telling "aspirational stories" is sort of a common buzzword. I think doing a serious documentary or expose about exploited poor people has some cache, politically. But setting a story in that world? I think most industry people just don't want to be associated with it, if even on a subconscious level. (This could all be projection on my part.)
That said, I do think there's room for moore. Here's a magic trick that's worked for me the last year: instead of saying that my story or idea is about class, or is in a blue collar world, I describe it as "_______ meets PARASITE." So, it's not a story about the energy industry and class in America, it's "ERIN BROCKOVICH meets PARASITE in the world of big coal." It's not a supernatural story with themes about class and historical trauma, it's "THE SHINING meets PARASITE."
Luckily for those of us interested in poor or working class stories, NOMADLAND also just won best movie. So that's two straight awards darlings with industry cache that have to do with class. So instead of using a word like "class" or "poor" or "blue collar," if you're talking to an industry person, maybe find a way to connect your project to a recent buzzy film or TV show w/ strong class elements.
In terms of self-mythologizing, I think I have my own tendency to be always building this mythic version of myself. Probably for a whole bunch of reasons that I don't particularly want to understand. In this rendering, my past is a house full of materials that I probably pick and choose from in order to build up that myth for myself. And its shape is some combo of where I was, where I am now, and where I want to be. Maybe the self-myth template is something like: "There I was in X, stuck doing Y, but here I am now telling this story to you. The story I want to tell taps into all of that, and it's a story only I can tell. If we do it right, it'll help us create Z."
thanks a lot for sharing Tangle Eye as well! Just finished it. Great read, great way to see that anticipation and uncertainty played out! Also, that first scene (and all subsequent flashbacks) was an emotional gut punch that made me want to keep reading. Cheers!
Hey Tony, I found a six part series in: GO INTO THE STORY, on writer: Mickey Fisher (creator of Extant and Reverie TV series.) I don't know if you know him/know of him-- but he sure seems like a likeable/cool dude.
Just thought I'd share it with you (and your readers), since he fits the bill of an "outsider" in the film industry, as you've also described yourself.
Interestingly, he touches on some of the same valuable insights (from the inside), that you have-- and many others.
He shares a lot of great lessons from personal experience; from the inception of his TV series concept/pilot, writing it, the pilot finally getting traction, getting repped-- all the way through to being green-lighted with a major TV studio. A valuable peek behind the curtain-- as it were. Enjoy.
https://gointothestory.blcklst.com/mickey-fisher-on-writing-selling-and-producing-a-tv-pilot-spec-script-part-1-7d25914b7fc8
Hi Tony, I hope you're well! As I've said many posts before, I sincerely, sincerely appreciate your efforts to share your knowledge! A million thanks. With that, I have a question I don't believe you've touched on but if you have, apologies - I'll get to it! I just haven't yet gotten through all your content (kid, work, writing, blah, blah).
Do you have any thoughts on the risk/benefit of producing content related to a script? I've got a production/acting background, a little Blackmagic camera and connections to a fair amount of good actors in Canada. Given how hard it is to sell specs, get noticed, etc., do you see there being any benefits to sending along, say, a self-produced trailer (taking for granted it's half decent) for a series? Would this in any way increase the odds of a show actually getting bought/produced/have others jump on board for a package? I know the odds are SO slim but just thought I'd get your take. I'm 35 (wasted 15 years drinking) and want to try and make the most forward movement possible.
For example, I'm working on a dramedy series about a mild-mannered pianist who, after losing his arms in a fire and originally forsaking music, tries to become a singer/disability advocate despite the fact he's not great at singing. I know it's so hard to sell scripts but I actually want to get this made. I'm working with an actor friend of mine who would play the lead character and I do believe - given some of your other thoughts - that it's got a lot of the "right stuff" in terms of making others look good. Who wouldn't want to jump on a show that deals with such subject matter in a funny with an unusual lead (... right)? He's been on an HBO show and is a legit good actor but not nearly at the level that he's broadly known. Am I delusional to think I could make this happen? Any thoughts broadly speaking on the matter? Given where you're at with your career (directing, writing, etc.), do you think you could have accelerated it if you'd produced some stuff along the way? Maybe written a micro-budget feature and shot it?
Thanks a LOAD in advance either way! <3
"In truth, I think not worrying about setting up a season of TV freed me to just make the pilot into a writing showcase."
THIS I needed to read. I've spent so much time banging my head over whether this or that pilot could sustain a season or a series, whether the protagonist has enough arc left or if I've cashed them in completely by the final act, whether there are enough peripheral loose ends, etc. etc. etc. I had it in my head that I'd need to talk about a script like I'm actually selling a show when, as you've made clear, that's not really what's being sold at the start.
It's interesting what you say about TANGLE EYE because I have no idea where that story was going to go--but to this day I really, really want to see it.
The other useful highlight here is your point about figuring out what, as an outsider, one has to offer. What particular perspective. I like how you put it--that vague admiration for craft from 100 readers doesn't measure up to a strong negative/positive reception. Freddie DeBoer made a similar point not too long ago:
"... consider the world in which I predicted the criticism and decided to make that piece less personal, less stylized, less intense…. In that world maybe the critics would go from disliking the piece intensely to liking it mildly. But those people who loved it would also now merely like it, and what would be gained?"
^This was a big insight for me, and your post has sort of solidified the insight in a more practical and specific way.
My mindset has has been: "I need to show competence and range." And that's what I've been working on: samples that will show that I understand storytelling form and that I can fit into all sorts of genres and jobs. There have been rewarding aspects to this, mainly in the way these goals work as exercises challenging me to try things that are outside my wheelhouse. BUT... to some degree, they also alienate me from my wheelhouse! As if a wheelhouse were some sort of dirty thing, when it really just means having an actual signature, an actual background, actual passions to communicate.
The fear of being pigeonholed resonates with the fear of being criticized: both fears ultimately separate us from our excitement, our desire. And then all that's left is the mild appreciation elicited by our competence and range. So... yeah. Like I said, I really needed to read this.
Thanks so much for this. It's been one of the most useful bits of screenwriting advice I've ever read, and has inspired me to reshuffle my creative priorities. I've started something new as a result, and am fired up. Enjoyed reading Tangle Eye too. Really want to know what happens to Hollis!
So glad you're enjoying the posts. In terms of the questions:
Resistance to poor/working class stories. I'd say it's more utter lack of interest than active resistance. You can feel the energy drop in any industry conversation when a story is set in a working class world, or if it has an active component about class. Everyone who has the power in the industry to say 'yes' to a project is of course quite rich, and probably comes from a privileged background. I just don't think they're interested in poorer worlds unless, say, a nice middle-class or better person gets yanked into a poorer world (OZARK/BREAKING BAD) or if it's a story about someone getting out. Telling "aspirational stories" is sort of a common buzzword. I think doing a serious documentary or expose about exploited poor people has some cache, politically. But setting a story in that world? I think most industry people just don't want to be associated with it, if even on a subconscious level. (This could all be projection on my part.)
That said, I do think there's room for moore. Here's a magic trick that's worked for me the last year: instead of saying that my story or idea is about class, or is in a blue collar world, I describe it as "_______ meets PARASITE." So, it's not a story about the energy industry and class in America, it's "ERIN BROCKOVICH meets PARASITE in the world of big coal." It's not a supernatural story with themes about class and historical trauma, it's "THE SHINING meets PARASITE."
Luckily for those of us interested in poor or working class stories, NOMADLAND also just won best movie. So that's two straight awards darlings with industry cache that have to do with class. So instead of using a word like "class" or "poor" or "blue collar," if you're talking to an industry person, maybe find a way to connect your project to a recent buzzy film or TV show w/ strong class elements.
In terms of self-mythologizing, I think I have my own tendency to be always building this mythic version of myself. Probably for a whole bunch of reasons that I don't particularly want to understand. In this rendering, my past is a house full of materials that I probably pick and choose from in order to build up that myth for myself. And its shape is some combo of where I was, where I am now, and where I want to be. Maybe the self-myth template is something like: "There I was in X, stuck doing Y, but here I am now telling this story to you. The story I want to tell taps into all of that, and it's a story only I can tell. If we do it right, it'll help us create Z."